post workout protein with milk or water ?

[Lowey]

Just wanted to know if you are better off having your protein with water or milk after a workout? as i have been told different answers by many people that should know.
Also does tribulus have much benefeit in bulking or getting stronger ?
Cheers Lowey

[xavmaster]

I probably shouldn't be answering here as this is benji's section but I haven't seen him on here for a bit.

Post workout there is no added benefit having milk and with the added latose from the milk it doesn't always make you feel to good after a hard leg workout 

Also if your having full cream milk that fats will slow the digestion of the protein so probably not ideal.

What are you currently having post workout apart from protein? and what protein are you having?

Tribulus is a funny one it's very popular as a herbal test booster but some people reckon it does more for libido more than anything but it is hard to tell how effective it is. I was waking up like a 13 year old boy every morning when I was taking it though

[The Blob]

Great answer Xav...

reps

[Needs More Pies]

I probably shouldn't be answering here as this is benji's section but I haven't seen him on here for a bit.

Post workout there is no added benefit having milk and with the added latose from the milk it doesn't always make you feel to good after a hard leg workout 

Also if your having full cream milk that fats will slow the digestion of the protein so probably not ideal.

What are you currently having post workout apart from protein? and what protein are you having?

Tribulus is a funny one it's very popular as a herbal test booster but some people reckon it does more for libido more than anything but it is hard to tell how effective it is. I was waking up like a 13 year old boy every morning when I was taking it though

Hahah the glory days of being 13!

[Lowey]

Xav basically just protein , fish oil and magnezium, what else should i be taking ?
Cheers

[xavmaster]

Xav basically just protein , fish oil and magnezium, what else should i be taking ?
Cheers

I would Basically I would cut the fish oil and keep that for before bed as that's when you want to slow digestion with fats.

I would add a fast realeasing carb like waxy maize, vitargo, dextrose or maltodextrin. It depends on your goals to how much you will need to take. This will spike insulin level, restore glycogen and will help get the other nutrients like your protein into your muscles faster.

I recommend vitamin c post workout at 500-1000mg which works out to be very cheap.

I also you a mixture of recover X (essential amino acid product), BCAA Pro and Glutaflex (100% L-Glutamine). I have pretty even amounts of all of these with slightly more of the bcaa's.

[Myst]

Xav what's the thought with Vitamin C PWO?

[xavmaster]

The main reason I use it is to reduce cortisol levels after training. I read a study or an article on it awhile back.

I think vitamin C is an underrated supplement and for how cheap it is I think it's deff worth the investment 

[Myst]

Yeah I'm taking 2 x 500mg tabs a day at the moment, mainly because they are sugar free and taste nice haha.

[xavmaster]

Yeah I'm taking 2 x 500mg tabs a day at the moment, mainly because they are sugar free and taste nice haha.

haha Yeah there gold when your dieting.

I use the powder but I still have the sugarless tabs so i can have a few when i diet 

[PUMBA]

I'm by NO means an expert, but just to throw some confusion in the air and create a bit of discussion.

This study may give weight to the milk theory.

[Psydone]

I'm by NO means an expert, but just to throw some confusion in the air and create a bit of discussion.

This study may give weight to the milk theory.

Darn it you got there first! Choccy Milk PWO, a big tick!

[Mailhot]

ah right! I'd say water for faster absorption of nutrients.
wondering how anything artificially made such as chocolate milk (not supplements) pwo going to help in recovery?

[The Blob]

ah right! I'd say water for faster absorption of nutrients.
wondering how anything artificially made such as chocolate milk (not supplements) pwo going to help in recovery?

I would agree and say that water would ultimately be better than chocolate milk due to the latter containing milk fat solids and casein, which will slow absorption.

However, as for artificially made, essentially it's just milk, sugar and cocoa powder!  The sugar is even added in the correct 3:1 ratio as advocated by some trainers. 

BTW:  Speaking from personal experience, my best competition total (deadlift and squat) was yielded by a chocolate milk fueled training routine.  have since switched to water and WPI/WPC but mainly for cost reasons.

[tubalard]

Why is a faster absorbed protein better than a slower absorbed protein  (bro-science alert !) ?

Studies show that total 24hr protein synthesis is unaffected by diet-induced 'spikes'; sure, you'll get more protein synthesis in the 2 hrs post-workout, but over the course of the whole day, it makes no difference at all.  And, given that muscle growth occurs over weeks, not hours, it doesn't seem to be worth worrying about.

Fast or slow, meh.  Total macro-nutrients and total energy is where the game is won and lost.

Cheers
Tubs

[tubalard]

Just as a follow up...

These two studies show that glycogen replenishment is not negatively affected by ingestion of fats post-workout:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=9480948&ordinalpos=1&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?cmd=retrieve&db=pubmed&list_uids=14978010&dopt=AbstractPlus

And this study:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=16679981&ordinalpos=1&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

...shows that post-workout whole milk beats skim milk for increasing net protein balance.

Fats are nothing to be afraid of...we evolved to eat them, and enjoy them !  So long as your macros and total energy is squared away, enjoy your choc milk moustache with gusto !

Cheers
Tubs

[PUMBA]

YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES!!!!!!!! LOOK OUT 

PUMBA'S ON HIS WAY TO GET A CHOCY MOOVE!!!!!!       not really.

[The Blob]

Why is a faster absorbed protein better than a slower absorbed protein  (bro-science alert !) ?

Studies show that total 24hr protein synthesis is unaffected by diet-induced 'spikes'; sure, you'll get more protein synthesis in the 2 hrs post-workout, but over the course of the whole day, it makes no difference at all.  And, given that muscle growth occurs over weeks, not hours, it doesn't seem to be worth worrying about.

Fast or slow, meh.  Total macro-nutrients and total energy is where the game is won and lost.

Cheers
Tubs

Myth buster Tub!

I always thought the benefit of PWO carbs and protein wasn't so much glycogen replenishment (although this was a beneficial side effect) but a dietary induced rapid rise in insulin levels.  Theoretically these could have been consumed all through the day, but the excess glucose in the bloodstream would have to go somewhere, and most likely to the belly if it were not for glycogen replenishment.  Plus, I imagine the pancreas would take a dim view of pushing out all the insulin at varying times of the day.

However, after a relatively exhaustive search of pubmed I couldn't find anything that actually verified the link between insulin and skeletal muscle growth*.  Am I missing something here or was this always a myth?

*  I found plenty of references to insulin-like growth factor however. 

[PUMBA]

Myth buster Tub!

I always thought the benefit of PWO carbs and protein wasn't so much glycogen replenishment (although this was a beneficial side effect) but a dietary induced rapid rise in insulin levels.  Theoretically these could have been consumed all through the day, but the excess glucose in the bloodstream would have to go somewhere, and most likely to the belly if it were not for glycogen replenishment.  Plus, I imagine the pancreas would take a dim view of pushing out all the insulin at varying times of the day.

However, after a relatively exhaustive search of pubmed I couldn't find anything that actually verified the link between insulin and skeletal muscle growth*.  Am I missing something here or was this always a myth?

*  I found plenty of references to insulin-like growth factor however. 

Maybe if the person was not consuming the carbs so much throughout the day (kind of doing the high protein, moderate fat thing) and then they get that choc milk hit PWO then that would be the sudden rise in blood sugar, thus triggering the insulin hit released from the pancreas that your talking about??? So it would depend on what's been going down the throat during the day.  (PLEASE SOME ONE CLARIFY) 

[xavmaster]

Why is a faster absorbed protein better than a slower absorbed protein  (bro-science alert !) ?

Studies show that total 24hr protein synthesis is unaffected by diet-induced 'spikes'; sure, you'll get more protein synthesis in the 2 hrs post-workout, but over the course of the whole day, it makes no difference at all.  And, given that muscle growth occurs over weeks, not hours, it doesn't seem to be worth worrying about.

Fast or slow, meh.  Total macro-nutrients and total energy is where the game is won and lost.

Cheers
Tubs

What do you have post workout tubs?

My main reason is spiking insulin levels and restoring muscle glycogen asap. this wouldn't be done as effectively with casein, fat, slightly slower releasing form of carb than say dextrose or maltodextrin. The question is why would you have chocolate milk? 

I think total macro's is more relative to weight loss rather than muscle gain. if your having fast releasing forms of protein such as whey, egg whites ect before bed and have no slow releasing forms of protein or no added fats to these protein sources you would gain muscle just as effectively? Protein synthesis doesn't occur if the protein isn't there lol